Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hello authors.
[00:00:01] Speaker B: I'm Joanne Morel, children's and young adult.
[00:00:03] Speaker A: Fiction writer and author of short nonfiction for authors.
[00:00:07] Speaker B: Thanks for joining me for the hybrid author podcast, sharing interviews from industry professionals to help you forge a career as a hybrid author, both independently and traditionally publishing your books. You can get the show notes for.
[00:00:20] Speaker A: Each episode and sign up for your.
[00:00:21] Speaker B: Free author pass over at the hybrid author website to discover your writing process.
[00:00:26] Speaker A: Get tips on how to publish productively.
[00:00:28] Speaker B: And get comfortable promoting your books at www.
[00:00:31] Speaker A: Dot.
[00:00:34] Speaker B: Let's crack on with the episode.
[00:00:42] Speaker C: Hello authors. I hope you're all keeping well in whatever part of the world you reside and listen to the podcast in. Today's interview is on TikTok tips for authors with fantasy author Renee Hayes and we're chatting finding the positive and productivity during major life events, her experiences building a platform on TikTok, whether TikTok sells books, Renee's overall tips for authors looking to use TikTok, her fantasy books publishing adventure, and much more.
So in my author adventure this week, we have hit three years of the hybrid author podcast that was actually on Tuesday, just gone and on doing a social well, I didn't plan on. I did in my head plan on doing a social media post and announcing it on the actual day. But I've just been super busy this week. It's just went over my head. And then when it's been come time to editing this weekly podcast, because I don't edit. I edit the week of release. I don't edit after the interviews and I batch interviews, you know, ahead of time.
[00:01:51] Speaker A: And yeah, it's just gone over my head.
[00:01:52] Speaker C: So anyway, I didn't want to let the anniversary pass by not mentioning it and celebrating it because I'm damn proud of the podcast and the content that I have shared with my wonderful listeners over these last three years. Three years. It's been absolutely insane. So for three years, this is episode 129 that I released today. I have conducted 129 interviews with authors, industry professionals, publishers, all sorts of different creative people across the world. And podcast has been downloaded 15,000 times. It's been listened to in over 41 countries. It really, really had positive feedback. And yeah, yeah, I'm just blown away by people who reach out to me often and say if the specific podcast episodes has helped them out or have shared good information and some people have sponsored well, yeah, I've had some sponsors off the podcast and that's been fantastic. And I've also had other listeners buy me a coffee to show support and it's just been absolutely incredible one of the things I love about the podcast is that I get to give back to the writing community. You know, I love to share other people's stories that comes through, as well as information that I'm receiving, which is great on my author adventure, too, because I'm in this with you. Having a career as a hybrid author, which we all know regular listeners, is not just one way of writing our books, publishing them and promoting them. It's effectively doing it all, trying different things and finding out what works for you. It's not staying the same, it's changing. It's open to all ideas and with no judgment of others. So I love how the podcast is evolving with every interview review that I do do, and the more that I take on the people that I meet, it's just absolutely incredible. Not just authors, but all the creatives in the publishing industry for all the different things that they're doing, and it's really inspiring. The podcast has always been a source of inspiration for myself, so I imagine it is for others, too. And I'm just lucky that I can look back and I've left, effectively a legacy for my children. So I don't have any other plans at this stage to change the way I do the podcast. There's no significant changes. After three years that's coming, it's still gonna be weekly. If anything, I might ramp it up next year or towards the end of the year with little bonus episodes, I don't know, little solo shows. I'm not sure. I have just continued on with how I run the podcast. The way that things are delivered to you via the episodes each week, and the way that my podcast process is at this point is still gonna just remain the same. Even though we've hit mid year tomorrow, it's mid year. So almost sort of assessing where you're at in your hybrid author aspirations or career or goals, and take stock if you need to change things up or you don't. I just want to say that I am recording this intro, as I always do in my car. I've just always.
I've just gotten used to that from when. If you listen to the podcast at the, you know, the start of last year, when I was caravanning with my family, and I just got used to doing it this way and I've just kind of kept going this way. But because I'm outside today and I'm in Perth, Western Australia, we're having the start of our wintery weather. So there is cars passing by, huddles. You can hear their car tires flapping in, there's rain. I think there's planes flying overhead. There's a couple people walking by. So if you get some background noise, that's to put the setting of where I am recording this. Intros and outros. Obviously, the interview was done at another time. I have been working on my women's fiction Kickstarter campaign project, which I can say I am aiming to release on the 1 July. So you're going to be hearing a lot more about that on social media and the ins and outs of that. So the book was written, got finished at the start of this year. It's been professionally edited. It's been professionally proofread. It has now gone to a printer for Typeset, and I've received that back to review shortly. The COVID design I've received first, I've received a couple of drafts, and really, it's, it's good to go. Mine are tweaks needed. The book's not the project on Kickstarter. The experience that goes along with reading the book is the project on Kickstarter. So I'm going to be discussing more about that in the coming weeks. And we love your feedback and what you think. Most people that I've spoke to, you know, friends and other creatives that I've talked to about it, they all seem pretty excited about it. And that's the point. It's a big undertaking, it's a big expense. So this kind of platform, Kickstarter, will help me to get this project off the ground. I am funding the book. That is a given. That's something that's going to be happening regardless of whether the Kickstarter reaches its goal or if the campaign goes ahead for the experiences that I'm offering. But yeah, I have started. My campaign is not open to the public yet because it's not created. But I have gone through and filled in the bits that are pretty easy to fill in. You know, the name of it and the subtitles and all that sort of things in my profile. My women's fiction book is written under a pseudonym, Zara Ellen. So there'll be more to come on that. But the campaign, you know, my name is still on there, and this is, well, it is my name, Joanne Zara Ellen Morel. It's my middle name. And really, the reasoning for that is just that I write non fiction. I have two non fiction books. Joanne Morell in that series, the author lining series, which is short nonfiction. Quick tip for authors looking to have sort of the nuts and bolts of an author career the emotional aspects, the physical aspects of business and organisation and things like that. And I write under sort of an abbreviation of my name for children's and young adult fiction, which is Jay Z Morrell. So that's my initials. And so women's fiction, what's left is Zara Ellen and I quite like it. I think it's nice and whimsical and flowery and all that sort of thing. I am also starting to get my head into the Rottnest Writers retreat, which is next weekend. I'm leaving on Thursday to sail across to the island of Rottnest. And that writer's retreat is something it's part of Squibbi, the Society of Children's book Writers and illustrators. I am so excited. I'm starting to kind of get work ready and tweak for that and think about what I'm taking, packing, that sort of thing, and probably will start thinking over the weekend about what I actually want to get done there. And I'm so excited. It's been two years since I've been across there and we've had this experience. I'm going to take heaps of warm clothes and I'm just actually starting to think that I'm going to put together a live, I don't know about live, but a special podcast maybe the following week about that trip and interview a couple authors or. Yeah, let's. We'll go from there. So that will be exciting and interesting.
[00:08:46] Speaker B: Thorn creative where beautiful websites for authors are brought to life. No matter what stage youre at with your writing, your stories deserve a dedicated space to shine. Whether youre just starting out or have a bookshelf full of bestsellers, your website is the hub of your author business. Finding everything you and your books offer together, Thorne creative can nurture all aspects of redesigning your old site or start afresh from the initial design. They can provide ongoing hosting and maintenance to marketing your books online, saving you time, money and stress trying to wrangle your site yourself. An author website built by Thorne Creative can easily direct readers to your favourite retailers, your publisher, or simply set you up to sell to them direct. The options are endless. Thorne Creative have worked with many authors across all genres and know what goes into good, functional working author websites. To sell books, head on over to thorncreative.com dot au websitesforauthors to read author and publisher testimonials and to see what they offer and some of the sites they've created.
[00:10:14] Speaker A: Born in tropical far north Queensland, Renee Hayes, author of Fantasy books. The Girl who broke the world and the Girl who freed the darkness is a true dream architect who crafts captivating tales that transport readers to realms where the extraordinary becomes reality. After working as a dental assistant for six years, Renee's life has turned onto a path where she can now pour her dreams into her stories. Fantastic. Welcome to the hybrid author podcast, Renee.
[00:10:43] Speaker D: Hi, Joanne. Happy to be here. Thanks for having me.
[00:10:46] Speaker A: Oh, we're so happy to have you. We're just going to get started. Can you tell us how you came to join the writing and publishing worlds?
[00:10:52] Speaker D: Yeah, of course. It actually all started when something really horrible happened in my life.
I suffered a really bad back injury at work and I was stuck in bed for months in heaps of pain, like, excruciating pain. And I just needed something. Nothing was helping. I needed something to keep my mind positive. And that's where I actually started writing. I didn't even own a laptop.
I didn't really know what I was doing. I just knew I had this story coming to me and materializing in my mind. And that's where I wrote the first draft in my notepad of the girl who broke the world before it got into an editor's hands and became published. Something really, really horrible, probably one of the most unexpected, craziest things in my life, sort of threw me onto a path that I, I'd always, always wanted, always dreamed about, but just never had the time or means to make it happen until I guess the universe said, here you go.
[00:11:58] Speaker A: Oh, gosh, no. Well, that's quite a story, and, oh, it's horrible that it had to come like that, I suppose, you know? Oh, gosh, were you beforehand, obviously, you sounded like you had a passion for writing beforehand. Were you a reader? Did you do much at school or.
[00:12:13] Speaker D: I was definitely a reader. I love reading. It just. It just takes you away from reality, just gives you that escape of all your problems that are going on in life, so. Always loved reading, and when I was a kid, definitely fantasy genres or always fantasy. Always loved fantasy. Just anything that was just sparked not reality. Yeah, pretty much anything that could just get me away from reality, really. The wilder, the better. Yeah. And when I was in primary school, I'm not gonna say I wasn't good at much, but I didn't excel it much. I just scooted by in school and the only thing I really got awards or anything for was story writing when I was in primary school. So that always, you know, when you're a kid and you get some awards or you get acknowledgement for something you've put work into always, you know, gives you that spark of motivation if nothing else in your life has sort of gone. Right.
[00:13:05] Speaker A: That's it, yeah. No, fantastic. Well, it sounds like, you know, it's meant to be. You're on. On the right path now. And, I mean, how did that work with you? If it's a backendary, are you just sort of lying on your back? Did you have the notepad, like, up above you? Kind of. Were you propped up or.
[00:13:19] Speaker D: I did. I had. I was able for, like, a certain time to have my knees up. And then I could first. When I first got injured, I could not move from, like, on my back.
[00:13:29] Speaker A: What did you do, just twist it or something or.
[00:13:31] Speaker D: Well, I just woke up one morning and. Excruciating pain. And as you do when you've grown up and told to be tough, I just dealt with it until I. I just couldn't anymore. And I rang the doctor and I burst the last disc in my back and the. It's called, like, the nucleus, like the inside I call the jelly.
Like, the disc jelly came out into my spinal area and crushed the nerve that runs down my right leg. So it was pretty bad. Yeah. And I just got told, don't move if you get. I wasn't quite, like. I had numbness and tingling, but just this pounding, excruciating. I don't know if you've ever had nerve pain or a toothache. It's just an incessant pain that won't go away.
[00:14:20] Speaker A: Gosh. And you have kids?
[00:14:22] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, I have a daughter and. Yeah, she's acknowledged in the acknowledgments in my first book because she then turned, had to look after me and she made me veggie my toast.
[00:14:36] Speaker A: Oh, my gosh.
[00:14:38] Speaker D: And she's actually got a mild form of cerebral palsy. So it was really heartbreaking for me to have to watch my little girl that I should be looking after, help look after me.
It was really strange. Like a strange event. Like, why is this happening to me? Like, this is so. Yeah. And I just thought, I can't just do nothing with this or I'm just not going to make it through. I need to do something.
[00:15:08] Speaker A: Yeah. Because otherwise, you know, your thoughts and stuff, I would imagine you could. You've got the opportunity there. Well, opportunity, it's not the best word, but your thoughts and yourself could have gone a different way. You could have really have gone down a more of a depressive path.
[00:15:25] Speaker D: You know, it was actually really scary. You just saying that was the whole thing I was just trying to avoid because it's just, it was every single ingredient for, just the recipe for absolutely absolute destruction I guess. Like it was really horrible and depressing and scary. So.
[00:15:43] Speaker A: Yeah. Cause you can, you would do something like that. You know, it's, you could, I could see easily you could get caught in your head, why me? Why is this happening? And all the rest. So I applaud you and commend you for turning it into a positive thing. And the title of the first work, you know, the girl who broke the world and effectively your back was broken. Is that any link there?
[00:16:05] Speaker D: Oh, it's not really a link to the story but in my mind feel a link to when I look at it. Yeah, that's my first book is just about a girl who in the story she doesn't really know what's going on and she has all these things thrown her way in the book and yeah, she effectively breaks the world in the book the way as she saw it in her mind she was kind of forced into her journey as well, I guess.
[00:16:30] Speaker A: So you wrote the book and then what was the publishing journey like?
[00:16:34] Speaker D: So I'm very very technologically allergic.
I pretty much just started researching, googling, like what do I do now? I found an editor and she was quite close. She was in Cannes. And I just sort of put a little message out to her, hey, this is what's happened. I've actually written the first book. I would love your advice on it. So just not even getting started. Just her advice. Whether you think this is worth it or you know, it's no good rubbish, you need to go and start again or just, just like any advice she could offer. And she came back to me and she said she really liked my story, definitely needed editing but she could help me like start everything. And that was just the start. That was so exciting. That was the most joy I'd felt in, you know, a year and that's where I went from. I, so I found my editor and she helped me publish self publishing. She knew a cover artist.
It was a lot more work like, so you've written the book and you think oh wow, like cool, I did it. No, like it's way more work than that.
But it's, she just helped put it into steps. She knew what she was doing. There's nothing harder when you want to do something and you just feel you have no clue and you've got to start somewhere. So I just asked her lots of questions. Thank goodness. She's so lovely. And patient, and that's how it all started. And she's helped me with the second book, and she's about to be sent the third book that I actually just finished writing yesterday.
[00:18:14] Speaker A: Amazing. That sounds really like it's all come together. And so, well, today's topic is on TikTok for authors. So how did you. Well, TikTok tips for authors. Once you've obviously gone through, you've written the work, you find editor. She was helping you get all, you know, get it all together. Did you then start to think about marketing, or was it each step? Had you thought about marketing beforehand?
[00:18:37] Speaker D: No. So I was just way too swept up in how excited I was about the book and that I'd written it. Then the marketing came, like, oh, wow, like, I've got it. You know, I've got to get my book out there. And I actually met a friend. She's in town and she's on TikTok, and she was so amazing helping me. She's actually got her own Facebook group now. She's got.
[00:18:58] Speaker A: Oh, cool.
[00:18:59] Speaker D: I think they just hit over 5000 followers on Facebook.
[00:19:02] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:19:03] Speaker D: Yeah, so she's amazing. Her name's sky, and her book, her group's called books and pictures. And it's just, it's just all, it's so beautiful. Like, there's so many authors on there, so many readers. They're all so positive. She does, like, a weekly chat, so she actually helped me set it up on my phone because I'm just hopeless. And it's one of these things. It just, I guess I really prove that any author could go on TikTok, and what it does is just, you can make any little videos or anything about your book, and you can get connected with people that really are interested in the same things as you. My life, I sort of, I wasn't even that excited. I was like, oh, yeah, I wrote this cool book. Just because in real life, like, you may not have people that are super into fantasy or books or anything, and then you join, like, like, this online book talk, TikTok community, and everyone just has the same passion as you. It's kind of like, oh, my gosh, I found my people.
[00:20:02] Speaker A: No. Nice. Yeah, yeah.
[00:20:04] Speaker D: I don't have a huge following. I've probably only been on there for a year or so, but it just proves it. Like, anyone can do it. And I've made friends on there that just love my book. Like, they're hanging out for book three. And to me, that's just crazy that people are enjoying, you know, something I wrote that helped me, and, you know, I really do help that. I hope that people, when they read, are exactly like me, and it just takes them from away from any troubles that they have in their own life.
And I really, really feel that TikTok has helped with sales as well. Like, the COVID on my books are just gorgeous. She did such an amazing job with the covers.
[00:20:42] Speaker A: Did you sort of give them free reign or did you have an idea of what you wanted and stuff?
[00:20:46] Speaker D: I sort of had a bit of an idea, yeah. I had colors and things in mind, and she came back with something that I hadn't initially thought about myself, but I really loved it and it really matched the story. So we've gone on from there, and she just. So vibrant, and they're so beautiful. She's just brought my imagination to life.
[00:21:05] Speaker A: That's cool.
[00:21:06] Speaker D: That really makes it fun, too, with TikTok, because you can take all these really cool little videos with your book. And not just that, like, even, like, there's a lot of nature based around my book. In the fantasy world, and especially in Queensland where we live, you can just be creative, I guess, if you don't know where to start too. A lot of people go, oh, I wouldn't even know what to post. Like, I can't think of, like, content, like, things to put on there. I just. Just. Whatever's on your mind, like, you don't have to go and look at what someone else is putting on TikTok. I think the more unique you are, the more people see your stuff and it might stand out to them because it's different.
[00:21:39] Speaker A: Yeah. Do you feel with TikTok, people have just said it's like a sort of younger demographic, so, you know, it's a lot of younger kids, I guess ya, that sort of thing. So for people who maybe are writing, like for adults or nonfiction and stuff, do you think it's the place for them or not really. Do you think it is a younger demographic on there?
[00:21:58] Speaker D: Just in my opinion, absolutely not. Like, I think it's for any age whatsoever. No matter what. If you're an author or you're older, or your books are aimed at people who are older, like, there are readers on there. Just love all books.
[00:22:12] Speaker A: Okay, that's good.
[00:22:14] Speaker D: Yeah. And even I don't, like, I love gardening as well.
There are a lot of older people on TikTok that just. Yeah. So I don't think it's just for the younger kids. I obviously felt like, oh, my gosh, what am I doing? Like, I'm in my thirties, like, why? Why do I have TikTok? My daughter, I won't even let my daughter have this. I just sort of had this. I guess it has a stigma around it where you just think, oh, gosh, this is just for kid. Yeah, but it's really not. It's like, it's. Yeah.
[00:22:42] Speaker A: Have you heard as well? Because is it a chinese platform? I think I've heard that, yes. But then, you know, there's talk about it's more in the government places, I guess, like, say, in the US, they are talking about banning it because they're nervous about it being used as some sort of, like, spy tool. So have you heard any talk about that? Does that concern you in any way, or.
[00:23:04] Speaker D: No, I have heard things like this, but I'm not too worried because a lot of the things I put on there are just about my book. Yeah, things like that. But it is a little bit eerie when you say, what say I find one video that I liked, and I'll watch that, and then multiple videos very, very similar come up after that, and you think, oh, gosh, that was strange, obviously, because, you know, they're narrowing in on what you like to watch, and obviously it must gather information on.
[00:23:33] Speaker A: Oh, yeah.
Like the algorithms or something. But even for myself, and this is not TikTok, I noticed the other day, like, I'm looking at hiring a va. And since then, I don't know. I see, I feel like I've had a lot of people contact me through LinkedIn or just certain things, and I just think, well, hang on, maybe I've said this on the podcast before, but I haven't actually done, or maybe I typed it in the Internet search, and then it just. It's same. It creeps you out. Like, when all that stuff starts appearing, it's like, oh, who's listening? Who's watching?
[00:24:05] Speaker D: I absolutely agree. And, like, before this all started, I. I wouldn't even post on Facebook, like, my personal life. So I was always, like, my stuff out there. But I think because it's about a book and it's about my journey and positive things and things I want out there. It doesn't worry me so much now, but I am quite careful. Like, I would never post a video that I. There would be anything in there that I think, oh, I don't want someone to see that, or, that's too classic.
[00:24:35] Speaker A: And so have you just focused on TikTok here with your books? You're not. Not. You're not posting on the other platforms.
[00:24:40] Speaker D: And stuff, mostly TikTok's got my most followers and that, but I do have Instagram.
[00:24:45] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:24:46] Speaker D: Which is diff. Like, it's quite different to use. And I have a Facebook page as well, so, Renee, like a face page. TikTok's really the one where I've just gathered so many followers, and there's always people, I guess, are more confident to comment on there.
[00:25:00] Speaker A: Have you strategically put videos up in terms of, like, you know what? You know, social media marketing? And they say you're supposed to post it this time, and it's supposed to be this length, and it's blah, blah, blah. Have you ever thought of that or. No, you just, you're organically, creatively posting and just reaching people that way.
[00:25:19] Speaker D: I think, like, I see those things and I think, oh, who's got that right?
I guess it's more like, I guess it's the way I work. Like, if I don't feel like writing, I can't sit down and write. So if I didn't feel like, like, if I was like, you have to make, in my mind, told myself, you have to make this video, and it has to be the song. You have to talk about this. I just wouldn't want to do it.
[00:25:40] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:25:42] Speaker D: So yesterday I'd finished writing, and I was super excited, so I just popped a little video up, like, just finished book three, like the first draft, obviously. And I just, I just do it whenever I feel like it, I guess.
[00:25:53] Speaker A: Yeah. And so it's, if you're doing it whenever you feel like it is, a, are you noticing that it's weekly or every couple weeks or every couple days or you're not too show?
[00:26:04] Speaker D: I try to make it weekly, like you do notice if you don't post for a while, you don't, you know, you sort of lose the views, like, getting many views. So I do try and be consistent, and when I am super excited or something's happening, like, oh, like, I'll probably post a lot more now I'm not focused on writing the book, so I'll start posting about ideas I have for a cover page or how the editor's going with it, or just little things like that, like little updates. People, I think, love to see. I guess if, if you really wanted to try and, like, if you're diff, this is just because I'm personally just, like, a person who likes to do things when I feel creative and stuff. And TikTok is like, a really creative platform, I guess. But if you are someone who are like, you've got to make a video that is this long or about this, then I guess the algorithm may like that and spread it to more people. So that would be if you're an author that was trying to get your.
[00:26:56] Speaker A: Book out there and it's a video platform as a it, like, it's a video medium. It's all videos.
[00:27:03] Speaker D: It's definitely mostly all videos, but I think just recently, like, they're saying you can post, there are photos on there, so you can post a photo and put a little thing up, and then you can swipe right and have a look at the rest of the photos on someone's post. But I'm not sure if that's new or that's always been there. But I have seen a lot more photos coming.
[00:27:19] Speaker A: So you've been quite comfortable using video, like, as a format that's come quite naturally to you?
[00:27:25] Speaker D: Not of myself, no. Like, I have. Sorry for any authors that just cringe. Like, that was me, too.
[00:27:32] Speaker A: A lot of do.
[00:27:32] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, absolutely. Like, you want to write books and be at home and comfortable and no one looking at you. Yeah.
[00:27:42] Speaker A: Hence why I hide behind the podcast.
[00:27:46] Speaker D: Yeah. So I definitely stepped out of my comfort zone with them. But the good thing I'm finding out on TikTok, you don't have to actually film yourself or your own face or even your voice. Like, a lot of my videos now are just, like, my book and little notes. You can type a little note over the top or nice music, like, just make it artful. And, like, there's a lot of. There's an autistic author that I follow, and she's really cool, and she does never her face or never her voice. She puts out really cool videos, like, with her hands and all beautiful things just surrounding her books with, like, moss and little mushrooms and just, you know, and she'll just talk, like, as you look at that beautiful imagery, there'll be a message there which also catch a lot of people's eyes. So, yeah, you definitely don't have to go think that TikTok's all about talking and showing your face and.
[00:28:34] Speaker A: Yeah. So would your advice to be to authors looking to get started, to just obviously join the platform and start having a look in their genre at what other people are doing or just at book talk in general, and then start to get a feel for the platform, an idea, and what they could maybe do, like, actually think about it that way 100%.
[00:28:52] Speaker D: I would just say join. Start watching videos that, and if you find any that you like, then, you know, follow that person and things that like, they have to be things that you like, you don't want to put anything up there that's not, you don't like or you don't feel proud of or you don't want people seeing because it just, you won't find like your.
[00:29:11] Speaker A: People just be authentic.
[00:29:13] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, just be yourself and don't, yeah, like try new things. But if you're like, like, you know, oh, I can glad I did that, but I don't want to do any more of those type of things. You just, I reckon just be brave. Like I was oh so, so anti social and thought, oh gosh, I can't do this. And now I'm like, oh, I'm really, really glad I have because I've found people and I found books that I would never have read as well on there that have turned into some of my favorites and they're by indie authors as well.
[00:29:42] Speaker A: So have you actually, sorry to cut you off. Have you actually bought from them direct or you've just written it down and.
[00:29:47] Speaker D: You can save the video? And I haven't actually bought directly from them because a lot of authors haven't got that set up, but they'll be, they'll be on Amazon or booktopia or their platform that they sell their books on. Most, most indie authors definitely on Amazon because it's just such a massive, massive place and it is really easy for such a small author to get their book on there and get it at an affordable price. It is so expensive to print books in Australia as well, which is another struggle, I guess, for indie authors here. Like you can walk into the shop and buy a huge big author authors famous author's book for $12 at Kmart or big W. And I mean, it's amazing for readers, but it's also like, oh, I can't do that.
[00:30:32] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, not fair enough. So how does the platform actually work? Like you, it's obviously, is it just like a video feed and you're scrolling through? Does it have features like Instagram like stories and things like that? Is there different sort of. I guess it's formats. Well, no, we've already said that. Not formats. But is there. Yeah. Is there different things like that?
[00:30:50] Speaker D: Like, so it'll just, yeah, they do lives as well. Like TikTok lives. So people can obviously like film themselves, go on here live and you can watch, say they're having an interview or some people I think do whilst they're writing, but it's mainly just a video and you sort of flick downwards. You flick through the videos and if you like someone or follow them, you could go into their profile and see a little bit of information about them, sort of like a little bit like a Facebook profile. And you can see all their videos and go in. Yeah, go into there and have a look if you like. Or you can just scroll through. You can search as well. Say you wanted to search ya fantasy. And then videos that have that tag will all come up. So you can search. And there's a lot of authors on there, there's videos you can search that they'll just give you so much information. Like people can give them questions like, how do I go about finding an agent? Or what are some tips on writing your first book? Just there's so much information on there from people who have done it as well, which is a really hard thing if you're trying to do something. Way I've always learned in life is you go and find something, you ask someone that does it. Like, if you wanted to learn a trade, you wanted to be a blacksmith, you'd go and find a blacksmith and they would teach you. It's really hard to go, I want to be an author, and then go and find an author in your town and then go and ask them to teach you. Like, there is none of that. So on TikTok, like, you kind of can. Someone's sitting there teaching you, telling you what they've done and their experiences and what worked, and it's like if you work it properly and search for things, it can be really, really helpful and just full of information that you wouldn't really be able to find where you would. But it's just so hard to find in the way the world works at the moment.
[00:32:25] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, that's it. And if you find that, they always say with social media, I guess not just TikTok, but the different posts over the.
Not the years, but so there's the written post, obviously. And I know that this is like a video platform, but is there more, have you seen, because you have shared some videos with your face in them, haven't you? Yeah. Have you found that you get more likes and more sort of engagement when your face is involved over, say, just your hands in your book, like they used to say, like, if you shared a post, if it was just writing, you wouldn't get that many sort of likes, but then if your face is there, people seem to be more connected to that. Have you heard that before? Have you noticed that with your posts?
[00:33:09] Speaker D: That's a good question, actually. I think honestly, I do think that is true. Like, some of the posts I put up, I guess if you're quite engaging, people will like to look at a face talking to you. So some of my posts that I have, one of them I put up was where I got into the finals for an award, and I was just talking. I was just in a good mood, too, so I was really happy and just sharing it. Yeah, I definitely think there'd be something there to do with that. You're more confident.
[00:33:34] Speaker A: I guess it's maybe just that connection and that human connection, and it's something that keeps coming up, I guess, on the podcast. And I'm hearing a lot lately as well, with all this generative AI chats between authors and stuff like that, and technology, just about being yourself and then sharing the emotion, human emotional stuff or whatever out there, and people will connect with you as well. And I think that comes across in people's books that I've been talking to recently, as well as why they're writing. They want to connect with others. And I think that's a lot of the reasons with writing anyway. But same with social media, I think.
[00:34:09] Speaker D: I think you're definitely onto something there, because now I'm thinking about it, I actually like when I go through and, like, I'll have some friends that they're TikTok friends, so they're people. You follow other authors, and when I do see their face, I recognize them. And I guess I take more time to watch that video because I've seen them before, what's familiar. And I'm like, oh, that's so and so. What are they up to? So I think you're right. It just shows people, they get to know you a little bit more, I guess, and, and gives them a connection. So I guess as you're going through all the videos and one pops up of someone you've seen before, you go, oh, what are they up to now?
[00:34:43] Speaker A: Yeah, no, that's it. And have you, you made TikTok friends in your own area that you've actually gone out and met as a group or. No, that's still just mostly online.
[00:34:52] Speaker D: It's all online for me, except that one amazing chick that I mentioned before, Skye. But I didn't actually meet her on TikTok. I met her on marketplace. She came, she came over to, I had an old bookshop I was selling, and she came over and brought it, and she was like, oh, do you like books? And from there, we were just chat, chat, chat, chat, chat. Like, on the same level, just like, full of beans. And then we became friends from there, and she taught me how to use it because I was asking her about it, and she already had an account and said, oh, like, don't be shy. Like, go for it. She's very confident and she. Yeah, from there, I guess we both. It's really nice to have people that are super interested in books and writing the same thing you are, because then you encourage each other. So she's writing her own book now. She's got this huge Facebook community that she's built with another really awesome chick, and she set up a book festival happening next year called Readers Unleashed.
[00:35:47] Speaker A: And it's cool.
[00:35:49] Speaker D: Yeah. So I've never been to one or I've never been an author in one, so that'll be a first for me. But. And especially because, like, up near Ken, usually you've got to fly to a city to go to those type of things. So I know she has made a lot of friends on TikTok that she meets in real life and knows in real life, it's a real, real connection, especially, I guess, for people who are at home all the time or in a small town or mums that are at home looking after kids all the time. It's just that little connection you have, the outside world.
[00:36:18] Speaker A: Human connection.
[00:36:23] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:36:24] Speaker A: And I think that, you know, there's a lot of stigma around social media being bad and people are on it too much or all this sort of stuff and the dangers and things, but it is nice to talk about the positives and how, you know, obviously TikTok sounds like one of them and your passion's coming through for it. I can. I can tell. I'm actually like, oh, maybe I should join. But I don't know how to put myself out there because I write a lot of different things, so I've really got to think about it. I mean, you've shared so much already, Renee, do you finally have any sort of overall tips about author creating a platform on TikTok or TikTok in general, or writing and publishing?
[00:36:58] Speaker D: Just really like, coming from someone who used to be like, oh, just. Just really give it a go. Like it is. My experience has been super positive. Start slow. Like, you don't have to put anything up. You can just go in, make an account, and sort of suss it out, see what it's all about. Watch a few videos. You'll find people that you genuinely like watching talking about books, and they are just so passionate. Like, these people love books, like some people, and it's not just that, like, there might be amazing libraries people have created in their homes or beautiful little sitting areas. Yeah. I just. I just think, like, if you being an author sometimes can be really feels isolating, you feel like, what am I doing? Like, I'm all on my own, like, I've written a book. I don't know if it's good you have those doubts and then going to, I guess a platform just full of people who are excited about the same thing, thing gives you that little boost or excitement or, you know, or if you've read the same book as someone's talking about, you're like, oh, I bought that when I read it, too. You know, it's just a bit of connection and I would just say, give it a go.
[00:38:00] Speaker A: Yeah, no, that's amazing. And we're so excited for your next book coming out and everything that you're doing. Are you able to share with us where everyone can discover you on TikTok and anywhere else on and offline?
[00:38:13] Speaker D: Yeah, of course. My name on there is just Renee Hazel. Very original.
And just on Instagram and Facebook as well. Renee Hayes, author, made it very simple. You can find me on there and excited to make some little videos and things about the third and final book in the trilogy because, oh, it's just such an amazing feeling to go, wow.
[00:38:36] Speaker A: I finished that and what are you going to do next? Have you thought about that? Is there another germ of an idea or.
[00:38:42] Speaker D: I've already written half of my next book, but I was really excited to write where I had to stop and go, hang on, woo down. You've got to finish, you know, you've got to finish your other books. So, yeah, I guess I'm excited that I've finished the first draft of that one. There's still a lot more work to do on it before it'll be up to getting published, but I guess I'm excited to just have that all finished. It's such a nice feeling to have it sort of all closed off and all beautiful. And if a lot of people love reading books that are finished, they don't want to read something and then go, oh, damn, I have to wait because it's not out yet. So I'm excited to see whether that changes or helps or lets more people find me because the trilogy will be finished or not. Yeah. So I'm just excited that it's given me a boost. Sometimes you can get into a bit of a slump when you're writing and it feels like a really long time between books and, yeah, yeah. On a high at the moment. Yeah.
[00:39:36] Speaker A: We can hear it in your voice, and that's amazing. Congrats.
[00:39:39] Speaker D: Thank you. It also helps it today. I just mentioned that I do get birthday cake because I have turned another year around the sun, and I was very excited to talk to you today.
[00:39:49] Speaker A: Oh, that is it your birthday today?
[00:39:51] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:39:51] Speaker A: Oh, happy birthday.
[00:39:53] Speaker D: Thank you.
[00:39:55] Speaker A: That's a bit different.
[00:39:56] Speaker D: What do you do for your birthday?
[00:39:57] Speaker A: Oh, I was interviewed on a podcast.
[00:39:59] Speaker D: Yeah. That's why I booked you today. I was like, oh, yeah, something good to look forward to.
[00:40:04] Speaker A: Well, I'm glad I got to spend it with you.
[00:40:07] Speaker D: Great.
[00:40:08] Speaker A: Fantastic. Well, thank you so much, Renee. That was wonderful talking to you, and you've inspired us all for joining TikTok and to go forth and read your books.
[00:40:17] Speaker D: Thanks so much, Joanne. Thank you. I had a lot of fun.
[00:40:27] Speaker C: So there you have it, folks. The absolutely positive and motivational lovely, lovely chat there with Renee. Hey, Hayes and her books are absolutely sensational. Please go check them out. Next time on the hybrid author podcast, we have Rebecca Newman and Sally Murphy, and we're chatting about their very special collaborative poetry anthology with many special local authors and illustrators. I wish you well on your author adventure this next week. That's it from me. Bye for now.
[00:40:57] Speaker B: That's the end for now, authors. I hope you're further forward in your author adventure after listening, and I hope.
[00:41:02] Speaker A: You'Ll listen next time.
[00:41:04] Speaker C: Remember to head on over to the.
[00:41:05] Speaker B: Hybrid author website at www.hybridauthor.com dot au to get your free author pass.
[00:41:12] Speaker C: It's bye for now.
